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Swarovski's New Binoculars??

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Postby ET on Thu Oct 09, 2008 7:45 am

Isn't that just the 3D effect of porros? My 8x42 porros do have more depth of field than my 8x32 roofs, and very simialr fov for the two. There is less focusing to do with the porros. The optics reason is something else, though.
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Postby Jne_K on Thu Oct 09, 2008 8:11 am

Hi

That 3D is one of the reasons you get more depth of field. No, not the only reasons, but an important one.
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Postby windstrings on Thu Oct 09, 2008 9:48 am

Thanks June, do you expect the new Swarovski to be a stiff competitor with the new Nikon EDG?, and if you had both in stock right now, would you recommend one over the other?

I'm in no rush, so I can wait for the swarovski if the price isn't too crazy... I would think it would have to be fairly comparable to the Nikon since thats the competition.
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Postby Jne_K on Thu Oct 09, 2008 10:08 am

Hi Windstrings

Good question. Thanks.

I consider the current version of the Swarovski to already be a competitor of the EDG or any other premium bino. When you get to this level, the differences in optics are minimal, even when you toss in HD, ED or other special glass options. Special glass has a much bigger impact on high magnification instruments like spotting scopes and telescopes. Moreover, I never have tested, and I dount I ever will, a binocular that scores at the top in each and every optical category. The EDG is fabulous, to be sure, but, in my personal experience as a customer well as my professional experience as an optics expert, it is more often the subjective factors - brand loyalty, brand preference, handling - that are the deciding factors in this price range. When you are spendng $1500 plus on a bino, it is as much or more an emotional decision as a logical one.

That said, can't wait to get my hands on the new Swaro. In the meantime, just got done playing with the new EDG and had to revive a couple of our employess who fainted. Ha!
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Postby windstrings on Thu Oct 09, 2008 2:53 pm

LOL!.... It does sound like Nikon really stepped up to the plate on this one....
its quite exciting to see glass getting better when you thought it never could.

I realize these subtle differences mean little and cannot demean a cheaper glass that already has excellent qualities, but its almost like getting a new car that runs as good as last years model, but you just have to have that snazzy bumper they put on the new one to make it stand out, and the extra feel in the new suspension!....

It will be exciting to see the tests between both of them when it comes out.

I don't know what kind of tests you are doing, but it would be quite fascinating to watch so I could join in the "pass out" crowd too!

I really do appreciate fine glass.... No so interested in hype or joining a certain club or glass cult as much as the experience of seeing a normal world turned into a wonderland when looking through fine glass.

Here is an interesting post about the new el 42
http://www.bornagainbirdwatcher.com/2008/08/swarovskis-new-el-42-desire-incarnate.html

thanks for your input..... you do a good service.
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Postby Jne_K on Fri Oct 10, 2008 5:52 am

Bless you, Windstrings. Always nice to hear from you and thanks for the link.
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Postby windstrings on Fri Oct 10, 2008 6:28 am

Thanks again Joanie!

I'm getting conflicing stories about when the new Swarovski may be released..... I've heard Jan 09 and I've heard not till 2010...

There is also speculation as to whether they will be actually better or worse specs than the Nikon EDG.

One person I spoke with stated that the very short minimum focusing distance of the expected Swarovski could indicate the depth of field could be worse than the Nikon EDG which appears to be a strong point of their new design.

I simply don't understand enough about the physics and makeup of the internal parts to guess accurately.

But depth of field is a major plus... the more you don't have to fiddle with the focusing ring to get a spectacular picture and see more, the better as this greatly increases the viewing pleasure as well as the likelihood to see an unnoticed animal or bird away from the targeted site, not to mention relieves eye strain all the more while encouraging longer viewing times.
Last edited by windstrings on Mon Oct 13, 2008 4:49 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby Jne_K on Fri Oct 10, 2008 6:48 am

Hi Windstrings

Take release dates from manufactuers with more than a grain of salt. I can tell you from an insider's perspective, that announced dates and actual delivery dates rarely match up. I would expect this to be even more likley, given the state of the global economy. Hang on.
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Postby windstrings on Fri Oct 10, 2008 7:05 am

I suspect your correct.

What are you feelings on the depth of field thing?... is it true that depth of field tends to suffer with glasses that have a shorter minimum focus?

The reason I ask, with my limited knowledge, that seems just the opposite of what I would expect as usually the shorter devices have better depth of field whereas spotting scopes, telephotos, and higher powers (ie: longer devices) have worse.

I heard some say its about the distance of the tubes from each other, but IMO that has little play as cameras, monocular, scopes all only have one tube and as the power increase, the depth of field tends to be less... but I assume thats due to the total length of the device (from eyepiece to the main lens) being longer or shorter.

The reason I"m trying to understand is to help make an accurate assessment as to whether the Swarovski with a 1.5 meter close focus may have better or worse depth of field than the current Nikon EDG with a 3 meter close focus.

Swarovski is obviously doing something crazy for one to be able to look down at your toes and focus!!!.... that "half distance", I assume would either express the superior workmanship and add advantages throughout the scale in the area of depth of field, or do just the opposite and cause one to pay the price by taking away depth of field in the distance.

Being able to zoom in and watch a pile of ants must be mesmerizing but I don't want that at the expense depth of field in the distance.
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Postby Jne_K on Fri Oct 10, 2008 7:34 am

Hi Windstrings

Depth of field in a binocular will never be good in any binocular at these minimum focus distances, whether it is 1.5 meters or 3 meters. Don't expect to see any DOF in any birding binocular until you are at least 10 meters and even then it will be minimal. Dropping from a 10x to an 8x will get you a touch more DOF, but never enough, in my opinion, to use as a basis for choosing an 8x over a 10x. A more realistic strategy for dealing with DOF issues at short range in a birding binocular is to choose a model that focuses, quickly, smoothly and precisely. That will be far more important than any tiny difference in DOF from one model to the next. In that respect, the EDG is superb, as is the current version of the EL. In fact, it was this very issue that spurred Swarovski to speed up the focus on the EL when it first appeared. If you want to wiat for the new EL, go for it, but make your decision on a factor other than DOF.
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Postby windstrings on Fri Oct 10, 2008 8:05 am

Thanks again....

its always nice to think we may see something "Unexpected" that we would normally ever attempt to focus on with a better DOF, then we could purposely focus on it to bring it in perfect.

But I understand your points and appreciate your input to prevent me from straining at a gnat and swallowing a camel!

That review I gave you the link for claimed the new Swarovski was notably better than the present EL..... I guess that will remain to be seen and some questions will never be answered till we get more reviews to compare these 3 glasses.... "present EL verses, New EL, verses Nikon EDG"
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Postby Jne_K on Fri Oct 10, 2008 8:28 am

Hi Windstrings

All we can do, yes. Of course, the EDG is available, now, if you need a temptation. LOL
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Postby windstrings on Mon Oct 13, 2008 5:10 pm

Maybe I should create another thread so I don't change the subject on this one.. but its really tough to find info on the new EL or the EDG for that matter.

I believe we may be waiting till 2010 on the EL.. although one sole source suggested Jan 09... I don't think that will pan out as he appears to be outnumbered by sources who think otherwise.

Now that I've done more reading... I discovered this term "Field Aberration" where the edges focus closer than the center causing things at the same distance as the center target to not be so clear, yet things closer are.

I noticed this in my EL's but I assumed that was a "desired" feature as most of the time whether a hunter or a birder, the objects in the periphery tend to be closer than the center "except maybe in dense foliage".

When viewing a canyon, or even another mountainside, the objects towards the edges are usually less yardage then the center.


However I can see that in some cases it would be desired to have the perfect edge to edge clarity all the way to the edge "hence the term EDG!".

The EDG appears to excel in in just that.....edge to edge clarity as well as depth of field according to the extremely rare materials I've been able to find and those to whom I've talked to who have had the chance to test the EDG.

It appears the heat is indeed turned up once again on the high end of the market.

The questions I have in my mind.... will the new Swaro EL have similar edge to edge characteristics as its current EL, or will it attempt to match the characteristics of the new Nikon EDG to compete for that characteristic?
I'm not sure which is in more demand.

My guess is they will keep what they have as "as I said" it can be a desired quality in many settings" to have the edges focus as slightly closer ranges.

But Joanie, I'm sure we could see some reviews, but it seems few like to do a review based on a prototype model... so we will have to see.
I would obviously love to see a review of the new Swaro EL vs. the EDG.

The Nikon EDG is definitely an attractive bugger with its touch of a burnt rusty color and it may be easier and quicker to focus... although some have complained about the diopter focus ring coming out too easily and that's supposed to be changed.

Based on the few reviews I have found, the EDG beats the old Swaro EL and the new Swaro EL beats the old EL.

So where does that leave the new EDG against the new Swaro EL?.. I don't know.

I'm just guessing by the new look on the Nikon EDG and the exact same price... that its attempting to steal the market from Swaro in that class.

It will be interesting to see if Swaro can make game points for the touchdown or loose by 3 points!
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Postby Jne_K on Tue Oct 14, 2008 5:47 am

Hi Windstrings

At this point, all we can do is speculate as to the new Swarovski. As for the EDG, yes, the EDG excels in edge sharpness, as did the Premier LX which it replaced. In my tests, Nikon has always been a leader in edge sharpness, af eature I am rather fussy about. I recently tested a current 8x42 EDG and it was as sharp at the edge of the field as the prototype. It did not disappoint.
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Postby Guest on Tue Oct 14, 2008 3:02 pm

Your just like a good cook... keep adding ingredients and stirring the pot and cranking up the heat and watching people salivate!.... thanks allot!!!.... :wink:
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Re: Swarovski's New Binoculars??

Postby windstrings on Wed Oct 21, 2009 11:35 am

So here it is Almost November of 09... has anyone heard anymore about when the new Swarovski EL's will be released?

I see the regular ones one sale all over the place, so maybe its soon?

Can any of you "in the know" people give us a hint?

I did find this.
http://www.birdwatching.com/optics/swarovski/swarovski_el.html

Nevermind.. I hate it when I answer my own question.
http://el.swarovskioptik.com/

Now for price?
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Re: Swarovski's New Binoculars??

Postby Jne_K on Thu Oct 22, 2009 6:46 am

Yes, it is true. The new Swarovski 10x42 EL HD will be out in January, or at least that is what Swaro is aiming for.
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Re: Swarovski's New Binoculars??

Postby windstrings on Thu Oct 22, 2009 6:51 am

When you go to "technical data" here "http://el.swarovskioptik.com/", it shows the 8.5 X 42 will also be in the mix.
399 FOV at 1000 yards!.. nice.. among other things.

Quite exciting.
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Re: Swarovski's New Binoculars??

Postby Jne_K on Thu Oct 22, 2009 7:17 am

Hey, I guarantee that new EL HD will knock your socks off.
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Re: Swarovski's New Binoculars??

Postby JGRaider on Thu Oct 22, 2009 7:56 am

I expect the new EL to knock your socks off too, along with your pocket book! I'm sure there will be a hefty price tag associated. I've read rave reviews here and elsewhere abou the EDG. How is Nikon's customer service? I know Swaro is second to none. Thanks.
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