shepherd rifle scopes? or which one to pick

i get tired of people that cant follow instructions. i have been useing shepherd [link=http://www.opticsplanet.com/leupold-brand.html]scopes[/link] for 23 years and have never had to rezero one of them! i own 6 of them and have a 1000 yd range on my land. i live in oregon and can tell you that leupolds are junk. i dont allow them on my range takes too long to get them sighted in. in 10 years no one has beaten me or my buddys who own these [link=http://www.opticsplanet.com/leupold-brand.html]scopes[/link] on first shot out to 1000 yds. i have kill deer out to 904 yds and elk at 953 yds. shepherds and berger bullets go hand in hand. DIT (dead in tracks).

I've used a Shepard PE-1E on my 338-378 for 7 years now and it has helped me take Elk at long range my last elk shot was at 1100 yards. This was a one shot one kill shot just put the 10 circle on the elk and pull the trigger from a prone position even had time to get back on the animal to see it drop and die within 30 yards. Got to love that Weatherby mark V and Shepard scope combo.

You know, I looked at my two reviews, and I didn't answer your question. Shepherds are designed for muzzle velocities and ballistic coeffecients. For a 300 winmag, you should get a P1 in either the 3x10 or the 6X18. It will match a .500 bc bullet Sierra 180gr, Nosler 180gr or Speer(Deep Curl 180gr., BC.475) out to at least 900 yds within 1moa of drop at 1000ft elevation with a mv of 2900-2925fps. With the 168/165gr boat tails, it does the same at higher mvs. At higher altitudes(6000ft and up) the rifle will shoot flatter but you can adjust the circles for drop at altitude and still be 'minute of deer or elk' out to 700 or farther. I will be putting a P1A on my 300 this year for use at 8000-10,000ft. It has a reticle designed for the fast Weatherbys, but by lowering the reticle two moa, it will match my hot 300 winmag loads within 5 inches of impact to 1000 yds with either Noslers or Sierras and the Speer 180 to 900. I'm not going to shoot elk that far away, but it means a 500 or 600 yd shot is much easier. Hope that answers your question.

I ran out of room on the last post, so: I have my newest Shepherd P2 on a .35 Whelen. As to recoil, I have used a program to determine the recoil of my loads and it is between 30 and 37 ftlbs. I have put over 1000 rds through this rifle with this scope on it and had no problems with zero or scope failure. I changed loads while hunting deer last year in the field from 250gr Speer to 225gr SierraGKs. I placed a [link=http://www.opticsplanet.com/targets.html]target[/link] at 348yds lased and fired at a 2" orange [link=http://www.opticsplanet.com/targets.html]target[/link] dot using the 350yd aim point with the 225gr. rd. I hit the 1" circle. Doesn't get any better. And yes at sea level the reticle doesn't match my loads to 1000yds, but it does match one to 600 and the other to 700. At 8000ft, tho, where the elk are, it matches both to 900 and one to 1000. And its a dual reticle system. I can dial the circles down to adjust for distance and left or right for windage(i've shot deer in a 30mph wind at 300yds with 180gr Ballistic tips). I can see my windage adjustments, too, and dial back to a no wind zero without counting clicks. Try that with any other scope. And I can range at ANY POWER. I don't have to just range at 10 power like most mildot [link=http://www.opticsplanet.com/leupold-brand.html]scopes[/link]. I loaned my Ruger with Shepherd to my hunting buddy when his [link=http://www.opticsplanet.com/leupold-rifle-scopes.html]Leupold scope[/link] broke and he used it to kill a nice 4x4 on Fort Riley at 430yds. He hit it through the heart with 5 minutes of legal light left. It was the longest shot he'd ever tried. The [link=http://www.opticsplanet.com]optics[/link] are clear. By the way, I have just bought my 4th Shepherd, a P1A, and intend to use it on elk with a .300WinMag this fall.

Gentlemen:
I own three Shepherds. I have used them in conditions of dusk, and killed deer with less than 5 minutes of legal light left. I have a Shepherd I bought in 1985 which is still in service. The only thing I have done with it is send it back to the factory about three years ago to get it checked out for Parallax. They went through the entire scope, referbished, cleaned and purged it for $15.00 shipping and handling. I have a Shepherd mounted on a 30-06 Ruger Mod. 77 Mk II, with the Ruger rings. This is a P2 3X10 power. I have used it to kill deer from 40 yds out to 500 yds. When my friends have given up on their [link=http://www.opticsplanet.com/leupold-brand.html]scopes[/link] due to low light conditions, I have killed deer with this [link=http://www.opticsplanet.com/riflescopes.html]rifle/scope[/link] combination. I bought this one in 1995 while in Germany. I didn't have any problems with getting it to mount properly on a Ruger, nor have I had problems with it losing zero. I have dropped it, and fallen down hills with it, and on one or two occasions had it move one or two clicks off of zero. I just moved it back and fired a confirming round. It has always been spot on. My third Shepherd is a P2 and is mounted on a .35 Whelen. I bought it in 2008. It matches the 250gr Speer to 700yds and the 225gr Sierra to 600 at sealevel. I do handload for the Whelen and scope. I have shot the Whelen at pop-up siluettes on Fort Riley's Privately owned Weapons Range (1000 Meter range) in a 20mph crosswind and hit the 700 meter pop-ups by dialing in windage and dialing the circles down in relation to the crosshairs and gotten repeated hits, and then dialed back to origional zero without having to 'count clicks' because I can see the changes in the scope for both windage and elevation. The only problem I have had with these [link=http://www.opticsplanet.com/leupold-brand.html]scopes[/link] have been a result of poor trigger on the Ruger (I put a Timney in it and solved that) and faulty tapping of the [link=http://www.opticsplanet.com/remington-brand.html]Remington[/link] CDL in 35 Whelen. I used windage adjustable rings and corrected that problem.

Shepherd [link=http://www.opticsplanet.com/leupold-brand.html]Scopes[/link]....hmmmm. I used to use [link=http://www.opticsplanet.com/redfield-brand.html]Redfield[/link], [link=http://www.opticsplanet.com/burris-brand.html]Burris[/link], or [link=http://www.opticsplanet.com/leupold-brand.html]Leupold[/link]. Then I ended up with a Shepherd. I had heard and read a lot of negative information about these [link=http://www.opticsplanet.com/leupold-brand.html]scopes[/link]. In fact, after picking one up at a large well known (nation wide) sporting goods store, I decided to have it mounted by the staff because of all the mounting problems I had read about. The guy in charge of the Gun Library informed me that these [link=http://www.opticsplanet.com/leupold-brand.html]scopes[/link] will not work on your rifle unless your rings and bases are perfectly true. The gentleman also stated that he had never seen one of these work on a Sako or Ruger rifle with integral bases. I wanted to take a chance with my Sako in hopes this scope would work. I am glad I did. It is true...if your rings and bases are not ture, this scope will likely not work. Most other [link=http://www.opticsplanet.com/leupold-brand.html]scopes[/link] are able to adjust much more than a Shepherd since they only have one reticle and therefore do not have the need to line up with another. Turns out when Shepherd blames your rifle or your scope mounting ability...it's true. It is easy to tell if a Shepherd scope is OK...you just look through it. If the two reticles stay lined up... it is OK. I love the fact that when I look through the scope I KNOW everything is still right on [link=http://www.opticsplanet.com/targets.html]target[/link]. Also, when adjusting for windage or elevation you can physically see that the change has taken place. You can't with any other scope. It is also easy to return to zero since you just match the other reticle that you did not move. Performance? Well lets just say that anything within 500 yards is a piece of cake. Beyond this distance any serious shooter should use a laser [link=http://www.opticsplanet.com/rangefinders1.html]rangefinder[/link] for ranging game. Also, beyond 500, wind, barametric pressure, humidity, temperature, elevation, etc... start to really matter. But...I will say this...By hand loading bullets with the correct Ballistic Coefficient and Velocity...I have regularly seen my Shepherd hit spot on out to 800 yards! This is with a 10X scope and so called crappy [link=http://www.OpticsPlanet.Com]optical[/link] quality. I will admit that looking through my Shepherd P2 is optically just like a [link=http://www.opticsplanet.com/leupold-brand.html]Leupold[/link] VX2 3-9. Not too shabby. A word of caution though...if you can't follow directions do not buy this scope. Sighting in is very different than a conventional scope. If you do not follow the directions you will complain that your scope is broken and likely blame Shepherd just like everyone else.

should have posted this one too.

Rick; the Sheperd is a little shy on optics and there are odd parallax's between all those range rings, The view is cluttered but those rings work for sighting and it is much faster than MIl dots for the average bear. It breaks too often and costs too much. I wish a good serious scope maker would use the same system and build it right. Sheperd in my experience is arrogant if you you have a problem and assumes it has to be you or something stupid you have done. Until they change their attitude with dealers and users they are doomed to sell Sheperds in piss aunt quanities. I guess sheep herders just can't build good scopes!
Try the Night Force model with the ranging rings. It's much better all around except the rings are not located vertical and it is slower as is the Springfield. The Springfield has mixed reviews, people I know and trust have praised it and others have condemned it. I wish I had tried it.

Bill Rogers <brogers@elkhart.com>
USA - Saturday, August 12, 2000 at 04:46:13 (ZULU) (your host address: 209.184.248.252)

Scopes - Shepard:



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another lurker surfaces! inherited a shepard scope with a [url=http://www.opticsplanet.com/remington-brand.html]remington[/url] 700police that I just could not pass up. It seems to do exactly what it should out to 200 meters, which is the longest range available to me right now. Does anyone have any experience with the shepard? I invite all comments, please. Have not worked with any scope with the mil-dot system, and wonder if the shepard compares with this system at all. Rod Ryan, your courses sound interesting, they are a long way from the western sea around Seattle. Is there a website associated with stormmountain, I have not checked.
scott woodbury <longline@att.net>
wa, USA - Friday, January 29, 1999 at 05:47:48 (ZULU)


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Shepards; Well I've been interested in that system they use for a long time. The 2nd crosshair is a great idea and there can be nothing simpler for range estimation. No slide rules to carry! The only thing is they just didn't go the full mile in building it. It has a reputation for not holding together. I've never heard anyone say that it did not shoot according to plan but the one's I've looked through lack a little in lense quality and that stuff tends to clog the visability. The company is a bear to deal with and dealers won't stock them much. I never saw over 2 in one place. I think it is the fact that you have to use only 1 caliber with the scope. Change caliber and you have to buy another $600 scope. If [url=http://www.opticsplanet.com/leupold-brand.html]Leupold[/url] or someone would do it I think it would sell like hot cakes. I would like to see squares instead of circles though on that cross hair.
B.Rogers <brogers@elkhart.com>
USA - Friday, January 29, 1999 at 14:45:10 (ZULU)


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Scott,
I have had a lot of experience with the Shepard scopes. I had one on my 300WM. It does all it was advertised to do but it had a short eye relief and would "Bite" you when shooting prone or off the bench. The other problem is the circles are so close in size after 600yds its hard to tell for sure which one to use. I loaded my 190s to 2900fps and shot it at 100yd intervals out to 700yds and it put 12 out of 16 rounds into a 4.5" circle on a silhouette [url=http://www.opticsplanet.com/targets.html]target[/url]. I found it to be very quick and easy to use once its adjusted. I would have liked to try one on a 308. Hope this helps.
Pat <mrbullet@hotmail.com>
USA - Friday, January 29, 1999 at 15:02:40 (ZULU)
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Amgoing to give up on the Shepherd. Comments posted earlier are well made. Cluttered reticle, coarse lines, and average optics. I think it would be a fine hunting scope, tho. Am leaning towards the VariX-III LR, previous threads seem to find it at least acceptable. Any comments in comparison to the MK4's other than price?
regards
scott
scott <longline@att.net>
wa, USA - Sunday, January 31, 1999 at 07:28:17 (ZULU)
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The person who refered to changing his Shepherd scope over to a "traditional" [url=http://www.opticsplanet.com/military-store.html]tactical[/url] (i.e. Leopold, B/L, etc.) is a very wise choice. Although the Shepherd is great for hunting and does pretty much what it says, I feel it still can not compete with the optics of the types of scopes mentioned above. Several of my friends in Montana did use Shepherds on their STW's and have great result. Anyway they did until I brought up some of the rifles I have with the Leopold and B/L Tactical. Needless to say they switched over. You really have to compare them side by side before you can a good realization how good these high end [url=http://www.opticsplanet.com/military-store.html]tactical[/url] scopes really are.
Al "the Fly Boy" O.
Al Ostapowicz <aaostapowicz@worldnet.att.net>
Clint is still my Hero in these Hall of Justice in , By Gawd O-Hi-ER, USA - Sunday, January 31, 1999 at 12:00:54 (ZULU)


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If I don't like the NP1 scope, I will change it for a Sheperd or
US optics. Has anyone here had any experience with the
Nightforce scope. I would apprerciate coments good or bad.
Good board Guys, I really like it.
Thor <Charlie01M@aol.com>
Conyers, Georgia, USA - Tuesday, February 02, 1999 at 01:57:35 (ZULU)


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Thor: I have a Shepherd on my rem700p... I am definitely in the market for a diferent scope. I think it would work ok hunting, but I do not like it for serious social wear. Now, to fess up, I have not had an chance to shoot it at more than 200 yards. At 100 the reticle is really busy, and I had to crank the LR reticle down out of the way to really see [url=http://www.opticsplanet.com/targets.html]target[/url] dots for load development. I think the stadia lines are way to coarse. I have several other scopes that are way brighter under the same conditions, and suspect that the optics are not really top of the line. That having been said, it works and is better than a lot of things that I have peered thru. I just think for the application that we are considering there are some better things out there for similar dollars. I am a newbie at the extended long range stuff, so someone may know better than I, real experience stuff.
seeya bye
longline
scott <longline@att.net>
wa, USA - Tuesday, February 02, 1999 at 06:10:10 (ZULU)


The military never decided to use this system for long range calculation so that tells you one thing.

It may help with bullet drop but since you aren't learning anything about range and calculation thereof, it doesn't teach you anything about making adjustments for windage at those long ranges. If you learn how to use the mil-dot system then you can calculate windage as easily as bullet drop compensation for the range.

These people are all saying that the optics aren't all that clear and bright for the price range of the scope. If that has changed more recently that would be good. I have no evidence of it.

And you have to get a unique scope for each different caliber you shoot.

So it has its pro's and con's.

I am not a believer.

Also this nonsense about all of the lenses in front of the reticle in the american system moving out of place such that your zero can be lost is kind of bs. The thing that moves in the scope that could be moved out of position and ruin your shot is the reticle adjusting system. Whether its one lense that moves in the X-Y axis to offset where the reticle appears or the reticle itself. So what we really need are scopes with good rugged reticle systems.

When the military adopts the system then I will give it some serious consideration.

i have 5 sheperd scopes that ive used since 2002 and just ordered two more this evening. i have sold my leopolds to buy these scopes and really like them as for not holding zero ive had no problem.I like being able to see if my scope has been knock off zero! Mounting of scope is shooters problem if scope is mounted right then there shouldnt be a problem.as for opics i havent seen any better for the price!

I have heard some serious complaints about the Shepherd scopes not holding zero. They say it doesn't matter because you can still see the offset point with their special system and yet a lot of people complain on a forum for shepherd scopes. They are not all that good in overall optical quality for the money you pay. Some say they work great and get the job done, others think they are way over priced for the quality. I wouldn't trust one to a magnum caliber rifle from the complaints I have heard about. Get something with a BDC reticle in a magnum rated scope like the [url=http://www.opticsplanet.com/bushnell.html]Bushnell[/url] 4200 series or equivalent and learn how to use it for your caliber.

I would highly recommend a good solid scope without gimmicks. Learn your trajectory and how to use a [url=http://www.opticsplanet.com/rangefinders1.html]rangefinder[/url] and practice, practice. In your price range you can look at the most popular scopes discussed in this forum: [url=http://www.opticsplanet.com/leupold-brand.html]Leupold[/url] VX-III, [url=http://www.opticsplanet.com/zeiss-brand.html]Zeiss[/url] Conquest, [url=http://www.opticsplanet.com/bushnell.html]Bushnell[/url] 4200. A medium magnification level in any of these series will serve you a lifetime, and be an appropriate accompaniment to your fine choice of gun. Also consider the [url=http://www.opticsplanet.com/swarovski-brand.html]Swarovski[/url] 4-12 AV.

Does anyone have any info on the shepherd [url=http://www.opticsplanet.com/riflescopes.html]rifle scope[/url] systems? I was considering that one, or one of the new laser range finding scopes...

I have been lucky enough to pick out my own Christmas present. I really need a new scope to go on a Weatherby submoa 300 win mag.

Any help will be greatly welcome?

canemaker